Crotalus cerastes

Ravnos · #1 (**permalink**) 10-17-2002, 07:14 PM

I was just wondering if anyone knew how to tell the difference between a mojave and a sonoran desert sidewinders. I got this little guy as a rescue last night... and I know he's not a colorado, but I can't really find any definiative data on the differences between the other two. Almost every book I've looked at only cites locality as the differing factor, and since I don't know locale, that kinda throws that out the window.

Rav

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The darkness might conquer, but it can never extinguish hope. And though one candle, or many, might flicker and die, new candles will be lit from the old. Thus hope's flame always burns, lighting the darkness until the coming of day.

biff · #2 (**permalink**) 10-17-2002, 10:14 PM

no help here on id...

just wanted to say nice pics!!!

Steve
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BWSmith · #3 (**permalink**) 10-17-2002, 10:23 PM

I am actually not sure how to tell. Sorry.
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JuliusSqueezer · #4 (**permalink**) 10-17-2002, 10:40 PM

I dunno either but I do know that ya don't want either of em crawling into your sleeping bag when you are out sleeping under the stars.
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biff · #5 (**permalink**) 10-18-2002, 05:00 AM

Your best bet is probably a guy named Wolfgang Wuster...his website is:

http://biology.bangor.ac.uk/~bss166/Taxa/AsNaja.htm

good luck
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jpaulson · #6 (**permalink**) 10-18-2002, 05:24 AM

Just wanted to say that that is a beautiful snake!! The close up on the head is great! Wish you the best of luck!!
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telefrag · #7 (**permalink**) 10-18-2002, 05:54 AM

Looks like it could be cercobombus, but its also close to a cerastes cerastes.

Tough call.
but at least you know its a sidewinder.

hmmmm
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ChrisRezendes · #8 (**permalink**) 10-18-2002, 06:19 AM

I'm no expert, but I'm almost certain that's not even a sidewinder. The head looks a bit too large, sidewinders have characteristically small heads. Also, the pattern doesn't correspond with those I've seen on any other sidewinders. The horns also look a bit too unpronounced and small. Here are some links to pics of the two subspecies in question-

Sonoran
http://myweb.cableone.net/azmilk/azs-swind.htm
http://spongebob.ncsa.uiuc.edu/mike/...ercobombus.htm

Mojave
http://www.californiaherps.com/snake....cerastes.html
http://www.xmission.com/~hoglezoo/images/mojaves.jpg
http://wwwstatic.kern.org/images/cal...dewinderbg.jpg
http://www.desertusa.com/mag98/april...s/ss_sidew.jpg

My main problem is that I honestly can't think of any rattlesnake species that DOES look like that. The closest thing I can think of is perhaps some subspecies of Crotalus mitchellii, or possibly (and not very likely), Crotalus lepidus. Sorry. [img]modules/Forum/images/smiles/icon_confused.gif[/img]
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Ravnos · #9 (**permalink**) 10-18-2002, 07:23 AM

I agree Chris... when I first saw her I didn't think cerastes either. I was initially thinking mitchelli, but most of them are darker, or the patterning is obviously different - it didn't fit at all. The diagnosis of cerastes was done by a friend of mine who is more familar with the variants of Crotalus than I... but I'm highly confused, because I can't find a single cerastes that has the same colors - but the patterning is similar. The head is certainly much more consistent with mitchelli though. Maybe a really differently colored pyrrhus? I guess I need to poke around some more books. I know its certainly not a lepidus, I keep those already. [img]modules/Forum/images/smiles/icon_smile.gif[/img]

Rav
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Dr.Oviparous · #10 (**permalink**) 10-18-2002, 07:31 AM

Not a clue, but have you tried posting him up on Venomous reptiles? They might be able to shed some light. -Juggalo
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ChrisRezendes · #11 (**permalink**) 10-18-2002, 07:34 AM

I'm quite inclined to agree with you on an oddly colored Mitchelli [img]modules/Forum/images/smiles/icon_cool.gif[/img]
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Ravnos · #12 (**permalink**) 10-18-2002, 08:02 AM

I've found some pics of mitchelli that are pink like she is... so I'm leaning more and more. I posted to venomousreptiles, lets see what the experts have to say. [img]modules/Forum/images/smiles/icon_smile.gif[/img] Of course, lucky for me, the care needs between the two species are not particularily different... and it sure beats the way she was kept before. Crammed in a large aquarium with an atrox and a viridis for room-mates and a folded over, what looked to be a former curtain, for a 'hidebox'. And no water at all.

Rav

_________________
The darkness might conquer, but it can never extinguish hope. And though one candle, or many, might flicker and die, new candles will be lit from the old. Thus hope's flame always burns, lighting the darkness until the coming of day.

Kohm · #13 (**permalink**) 10-18-2002, 04:25 PM

Sorry, I really know nuts about Crotalus. Just to say great pix, and lovely snake! I can't stand those idiots who abuse their herps. Lucky for her that she found you, or you found her.

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Ravnos · #14 (**permalink**) 10-22-2002, 03:36 PM

Well... general conscensus is that "It is definitely some kind of mitchelli, but I have no idea what kind." from several people with much more experience with AZ/CA animals than I. [img]modules/Forum/images/smiles/icon_smile.gif[/img] I have found pics of a pyrrhus that has the pink coloration (that doesn't come out very well in my shots) so I'm gonna go with that until someone tells me otherwise. [img]modules/Forum/images/smiles/icon_smile.gif[/img]

Rav

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