Copperhead in the neighborhood

[jpaulson]

I just got home this evening to find out that a little girl in our neighborhood was running down the street screaming a few hours ago, and my father-in-law had went to see what th commotion was about. Turns out there was a copperhead in the street!! Having no experience with snakes, he killed it with a shovel. Here is my question--why? They are building a new sub division next to us--was he driven out? Is there a family of them nesting nearby? There are many children, some my own, that frequently roam the neighborhood. Do I need to worry? BW, this is one for YOU!

[BWSmith]

In the Southeast, Copperheads are most versitile venomous snake and it often adapts very well to living near humans. I have pulled them out of just about every environment you can imagine. Most of the time they go unnoticed because of their cryptic nature. But they do cross paths with humans. He may have been hanging out for years or he may have been driven out becasue of construction. No way to really tell.

[jpaulson]

Do they travel in "packs"? Do I need to worry about my children walking down the road? Although I have taught them to not go near or touch wild snakes, they have grown to love snakes along with myself, so I am worried. Do you think this is an isolated case or is there a family close by?

Signed;
Scared parent

[JuliusSqueezer]

Yes You definatly need to worry about your kids walking down the road...but not because of the copperheads. Bad Georgia drivers pose a much more horrific threat as do the predator/sex crime offenders. Copperheads do not "run in packs" though it's not unusual to find them in pairs. Oddly though, every "pair" of copperheads I have ever found hanging out were both males...perhaps tagging along together on the scent trail of the same female? Anyway, they didn't survive millions of years of evolution by stalking large shovel weilding mammals. It's not like they are going to see your kids and go chase them down to bite them. If your kids don't step on them or mess with them, there is nothing to worry about. If given any chance at all, coppers will retreat. They are alot more flighty than rattlesnakes and a lot less venomous. Always aware, watching and quick to make a run for it. Their allertness and skittishness is what gets people bit though. Gardening...reaching down into and around the plants to pick near where a nervous copperhead is resting, people will often unknowingly poke their little plant picking fingers right in a copperhead's face. If you see one, there are more. Lots more. They don't advertise their existance. I've been on copperhead calls where I KNOW they are there and am looking for them and walk right over or by them several times before actually seeing them. You just have to learn to live with them if you want to live in a warm climate in the US. They are beneficial to the ecology, they pose far less threat to anyone than the dogs running around out there. And while yes they are indeed venomous, the mortality rate for a copperhead bite is almost nonexistant. If you are a healthy adult and get a full load from a large copper, you got hit with about 1/4 of what it would take to kill you. Most people suffer some swelling, a little pain and nothing more...but people react differently to venom so there is no blanket discription of what your symptoms or outcome will be. One of the vendors at the Aiken show got bit by one late saturday night. He just went to the hotel and got some sleep..was back at the show sunday morning with his swollen hand working and walking around like nothing happened.

[HavocovaH]

yeah, the mortality rate of venomous snakes in the US is so rare that you literally have more to worry about from a stray lightning bolt.

[jpaulson]

Originally Posted by JuliusSqueezer

Yes You definatly need to worry about your kids walking down the road...but not because of the copperheads. Bad Georgia drivers pose a much more horrific threat as do the predator/sex crime offenders.

Brett, you know my kids and know that they are not scared of snakes....that was my biggest concern. Sat them down this morning and had that "good snake, bad snake" talk. They seem to understand. What frightens me is the other neighbor girl that was the first to come up on the copper. She was walking right up to it, and the copper was in strike mode. Thank goodness me father in law got there in time. Adults can fend off the venom pretty well, but children are not so lucky.

As a side note, they are determined little suckers. This happened yesterday evening, and the "dead" snake was in the back of my in laws truck. As of this morning, it was still moving around some, but its jaw was obviously damaged. I came out to go to work around 11 am, and the snake was on the driveway!! It had managed to crawl or twist its way up and OVER the truck bed--and he had been on his deathbed. Anyway, I finished the job for good, so no more suffering.

[louise]

i tried so hard not to post on this thread but i can only take so much. so another words the poor snake suffered all night and still tried to just get away and was killed in the end anyways?
why couldn't the poor thing just be relocated???

[JuliusSqueezer]

Rediculous number one. Feeling the need to kill the snake. If you say it was your father in law,...I'll give you the benefit of the doubt but there are some things here that makes me wonder...What few envenomations we have here in the US, guess what the number one cause of the bite is in the first place...yep...trying to kill the snake. Leave them alone and they leave you alone. It's really not a hard lesson to teach a kid either...especially kids old enough to play in the street.

Rediculous number two. A somewhat experienced reptile hobbiest acting like a scared old granny because there is a copperhead on the street. You live in suburbia Georgia. There are plenty of copperheads in your neighborhood. Deal with it or move. Stop killing out of fright and ignorance. You have a snakehook and a bucket. Relocate, or call someone. BW and I take copperhead calls near weekly this time of year.

Rediculous number three. A somewhat experienced reptile hobbyist putting a mortally injured snake in the back of a pickup and noticing it still wiggling but not finishing it off till the next day. BTW, YOU put your kids in danger by doing this. A healthy copperhead wouldn't be near the threat to your kids as one that is injured, placed in a spot for currious kids to examine...

Saying that a copperhead bite can kill a kid or is more serious to a kid is just the responsible thing to say. an infant may not fair well but a kid old enough to play in the street? If the kid dies it's probably because of idiotic and inappropriate medical procedures, NOT from the venom. That could go for anyone...but it's all part of life. People die or get injured in cars..but we still get in them. People drown in bathtubs...but we still take bathes. If you don't want to expose your children to animals that can be potentially dangerous under special circumstances, go live in the city but I'm telling you, your kids are far more likely to fall victim to crime in the city than they are getting bit by a venomous snake. Knowing you and knowing how you like snakes, I'm rather surpised at your attitude and lack of research/education on probably the only venomous species in your neck of the woods. Shocked at your lack of compassion for the animal. "Thank God your father in law was there"? Whatever. God didn't do the snake any favor did he?

Now the real kicker. You come here telling this story expecting what sort of response? sympathy? The snake gets all the sympathy. You get none. You are guilty of animal cruelty and child endangerment whether by proxy or by your own doings...you are still guilty of both. Did you expect the same response from a group of seasoned herpers about a copperhead on your street that you would get in a beauty parlor? ok..."ooooo shiver". You lose all herper status, dude. Go ahead and get you a bumper sticker that says, "The Only Good Snake is a Dead Snake" ..and quit being a poser.