Jose's Vet Trip

[Alicewave]

I was never in denial. You have to realize that based on what I'm hearing from RTBers now, a lot of when I was told from RTBers when I first got Jose was wrong. For example, I was told by several people that air temp wasn't important for rosy's as long as substrate temp ranges from 80-88 during the day and 75-80 at night. No all of a sudden I am hearing different things. that's just ONE example. So pardon me if I get defensive but I was never in denial. I've just been trying to make sense out of the mess of conflicting info I have gotten ever since I got Jose. I'm not trying to prove right or wrong, I'm just saying you can't blame me for all this. All I have ever done is what the care sheets on rosyboa and rosyboas.com say and what I have learned talking to RTB people. I'm not saying everything I've done was always right but as far as what I was told from you guys it was. I even remember a conversation in chat a while ago when I said "I don't think this 25 watt bulb is getting the air temp very high. Should I try a 40 watt" And more than one person who I've trusted for info in the past said "No, 40 watt is way to much, air temp isn't that big a factor anyway." Just for once I'd like you all to look at it from my perspective. Over and over again I get attacked that it's my husbandry when all I've ever done is tried to make sense of the conflicting info I get. I get defensive because I know I'm not the only one who has experienced this. I will not name names but I've seen many RTBers force their opinions on people whether they are right or not just to look like they are always right and try to prove they are always right. That's when it gets in the way of the snake being healthy or not. I would never try to say I know everything about rosies or anything about snakes because Jose is my first, only, and frankly... my last. Put yourself in my position. Imagine what it's like to get bobbarded with conflicting info from people with egos flying all over the place. How am I supposed to nkow what's right? So I ask you to give me a break, I'm doing the best that I can. I can see that Jose needed more heat because he has been out to bask the last couple nights. But don't say I was in denial because how can I deny what I've only picked up from RTBers. I love you guys and I respect you but not everyone is always right and I've learned this with Leos, not all are the same and not everything works with every animal.
[addsig]

[JuliusSqueezer]

I doubt anyone knew that the house room temp stays at or under 60 degrees. There is a common sense factor here. I never tell anyone what wattage bulb to use because there are so many factors...best thing to do is experiment till you get the temps right. and air temp is always important. That's why the thermometer goes 1 inch above the cage floor and not on the floor or up near the top. I dunno who told you it doesn't matter but they need spanked.
[addsig]

[Alicewave]

Quote from Rosyboas.com under the captive care section:

Steer clear of heat lamps and use under tank heaters, or heat tape.

It's that quote that stimulate asking around in the first place. Maybe that site is bad but it's one of the two that nearly everyone suggested to me.

Also I will correct you again, my room temp is never at or below 60. At night it's rarely less than 75 with 4 reptile tanks in the room. I also have a sign on my BR door to keep the door closed at all times so that the heat doesn't escape.

And actually, for UTH I aws told by several people to put the thermometer just under the substrate to read the temp of the UTH. Now that I have the UTH on a thermostat I have the sensor for the thermostat there and the sensor for the thermometer one inch above. The UTH definitely does not warm the air at all.

And you say no one is out to scorn me... why then to you post such things as

<TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD><font class="pn-sub">Quote:</font><HR></TD></TR><TR><TD><FONT class="pn-sub"><BLOCKQUOTE> a gerbil or hamster? for a rosy? please tell me you are joking. </BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE>

which basically seems like you are trying to make me feel like an idiot without backing yourself up. You guys want me to take your advice seriously, then please, act like professionals.

BTW, the gerbil/hamster thing was advice from Faze, not something I pulled out of my rear end.



_________________
photo.redtailboa.net/Murtle

	Under Tank Heater Under Tank Heater

[Alicewave]

And here's the quote from Rosyboa.com

<TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD><font class="pn-sub">Quote:</font><HR></TD></TR><TR><TD><FONT class="pn-sub"><BLOCKQUOTE> Use of an undertank heating pad is one of the more effective ways to achieve a thermal gradient, particularly when using a thermostat controller. Surface temperatures should provide the following thermal gradient:

cooler side 78o-80oF&lt;---&gt;87o-90oF warmer side
Heat of this kind is much more preferable than use of a light. Lights rarely add value to maintaining healthy rosy boas and primarily serve to enhance the aesthetic qualities of the enclosure. Too much heat, or too little, can result in regurgitation, which often leads to more serious health consequences.
</BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE>

Notice the gradient described is &quot;surface temperature&quot; not ambient temperature. And since both sites say not to use lights, that's why I only used the 20 watt for the day/night cycle.
[addsig]

[JuliusSqueezer]

I don't use lights on them either but I have an 80 degree snake room.

Anyway...If I come across as crass and uncaring for your personal feelings, I'm sorry. I don't post what I do to try and make you feel good or bad about yourself. My only concern here is for your snake. Your personal issues can take a back seat for now till the snake gets better.
[addsig]

[Alicewave]

Hmm, there is a big difference between 80 degrees and 88 degrees.

Thanks for the apology. It has nothing to do with my personal feelings. It has to do with the effectiveness of the tactless statements a few of you make and the lies some of you like to spread. They don't help anything. They just make me disrespect you and your advice.

_________________
photo.redtailboa.net/Murtle

[JuliusSqueezer]

My final thoughts on this whole thing:

You wouldn't get such conflicting information if you didn't give so much yourself. Everything you have corrected, assuming you actually have...you try and pass off as you have been doing that all along.

You just mentioned a sign on your door to keep it closed so as not to let the heat out....but not long ago, you said you can't close the door because of a dog and at night the room temp drops to near 60.

Also....at one point, you put Jose up for adoption/rescue and had offers to get him healthy and if you want...returned to you once feeding...then you decided that proving your selfworth is more important than Jose's life.

SO ... I wish you luck...I wish Jose luck and a speedy recovery. But I dont think I or anyone else can help you unless you are willing to come clean on some things and go back to the start of his non feeding and tell the whole truth about everything that went on. I suspect the biggest issue is or WAS the temps. Corrected now or not does not erase the past.

Wanna take the pepsi challange? Ship Jose here and within 2 weeks, I will send you photos of him eating on his own if he arrives here alive. Then after he has had 6 meals, I will ship him back with clear instructions of how and what to feed him....this will give you time to make sure everything in his environment is up to par. Again....this is not to belittle you or put you down in anyway...and if it does fine, I'm a jerk...who cares? If I fail....I'll send you money to get a goldfish...they like the cold.
[addsig]

[Alicewave]

Thank you for proving my point. I could not keep the door closed because a week ago it was too hot. It had nothing to do with the dog. My father was home this week and he like to mess with things and it's cold this week so that is why I have a sign on the door.

I put him up for adoption because I was getting upset and felt drained. but then I got a rousounding lot of SUPPORTIVE emails from people telling me I could lick this thing so now I am determined to do it on my own. I thank those who offered to take him and I will consider then as a support system if I need it. But he is not anywhere near close to death, that's why I took him to the vet and the vet assured me as such.

And I got conflicting information right from the start so it has nothing to do with conflicting info I may or may not have given.

Anyway, you are not getting my snake because I flat out do not trust or respect you. I have a set of a few people who have been very helpful so far so I will continue to correspone with them via e-mail IM or whereever else. But I've noticed a lot of the most knowledgale people have left this forum for obvious reasons, and I've decided to do the same. Thank you again to those who have helped. This is my final post.


_________________
photo.redtailboa.net/Murtle

[JuliusSqueezer]

Roger that...flame out over and out
[addsig]