New baby Ball Pythons : advice.

[slaponte]

Ok, I said new. This are my first ones. I admit to low level knowledge. My daugther had one last year and I am familiar with them I also am reading everything I can. So be gentle!

Now, that last point, "reading everything I can" starts the problem. When you read advice that does not quite match your experience or other reading, it becomes hard to figure out which advice is right.

I will tell you what I have done so far : The babies arrived friday PM. I got two females and a male. Due to a slight space problem I got two 10G tanks for now, one for the females and one for the male. They have newspaper as substrate for now, a water bowl big enough for them to get in (I have seen them drink, and get wet, but not soak yet), a hide, heating pad under one side of the tank, light from above during the day, thermometer, etc... I am having a custom cage built for my largest BCI in the next two weeks, at which point all snakes will move "up" in space. [img]modules/Forum/images/smiles/icon_smile.gif[/img]

Of course, when they got here they were a little jumpy. Two had pooped on their way here, one pooped as soon as I put her in the tank. After a few minutes, they started checking out their new tanks. Fairly active, I must say, trying to climb up towards the screen top (locked).

Today Sat is feeding day around here. I ofered a fuzzy to each. Two ate right away. One ignored the fuzzy. After about 20 minutes, I decided not to press it and took the fuzzy away. They all seem ok, calm right now.

Comments on humidity level, please. Do BPs require more, less, or about the same levels as BCIs?

My question is about handling. I was at the store and saw this cute booklet on BPs and bought it. The Ball Python Manual by Vosjoli and Klingenberg. They advice NOT to handle the snakes the first 4 weeks, or until they eat 4 times, and then only handle 15 minutes per WEEK.

I know the idea is to let them settle down and aclimate, but at the same time, been babies, don't I want them to get used to been handled? Not a lot, but... with my BCIs when they were babies I handled them about every other day 10 or 15 minutes. Even now (they are 1 year olds) I handle them once or twice a week for 20 to 30 minutes. I also made it a point to gently handle their heads so they are OK with that.

So, little handling? Lots of handling? I recognize I have short experience with herps, and none with BPs. But for what I have seen with the BCIs, it would seem a routine is better than total hand-off for 4 weeks...

Is it also correct to assume that the constant climbing towards the screen top is a sign of fright and attempt to escape, == stress? They seem calm and not scared of my hands, as long as I move slowly.

All your thoughts are extremely apreciated.
[addsig]

	Boa Constrictor Imperator Boa Constrictor (Boa constrictor imperator). Most common is the Colombian Boa.

[cb76]

whats up slap!

i have owned a ton of royals over the past 3 years, but now maintain 6 in my collection. what you are doing sounds fine! the feeding sounds fine, and the soon to be housing will be fine.

royals are escape artist!! no dought about it. if you have a flaw in your caging, they will find it.
my guys ove around all night long- they are prolly on a "hunt" of some sort. this is normal. it does not mean stress or anything. about the drinking/ soaking- i see my guys drink all the time, but i hardly ever see them soak.

with the handling- when you first get a snake- it definitly needs an adjustment period. when i get mine, they dont see me for at least 2 weeks- then i attempt a first feed.

what vosjoli was aying i agree with to a point. some snakes do need a long settling in period. i currently have on thats been on it for 7 months now...... and counting.

fact, whether its a ball or burm or a boa, some snakes will deal with captivity hard and may never adjust. this is not true with all though........... [img]modules/Forum/images/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif[/img] thank god!

about the 15 minutes a week thing- no offence mr vosjoli, but i thnk thats garb!!! how the #$%^&#$%^&#$%^&#$%^& can you get a time on the type of situation this is!

what should of been said was if the snake is really stressed, do it in small handling sessions. with that being said- i can see what he means- do it a lil' once or twice a week for maybe 15 minutes each time.....

when ever i hold my royals- i hold them for hours at a time. sometimes i take them out side, and i am out all day long- into the night with them. they love it!!! fresh air- real sun!!! i put them back in their enclosures- and they rush to get back out. they still eat fine, shed fine, grow fine, etc......

what you are doing is good, but take it slow- these are new snakes. handle slowly i the begining, make sure all are established! meaning feeding regularly. just cause it ate once, doesnt mean it'll happen so easty the next time.

good luck with the snakes [img]modules/Forum/images/smiles/icon_wink.gif[/img]
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[impermanentrage]

<TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD><font class="pn-sub">Quote:</font><HR></TD></TR><TR><TD><FONT class="pn-sub"><BLOCKQUOTE>Comments on humidity level, please. Do BPs require more, less, or about the same levels as BCIs?

</BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE>

As on overall rule of thumb? Yes. you should take into consideration however that BP's are quite prone to dermatitis of many types. Air should be moderately humid, but not damp, and substrate should never be damp. Dysecdysis, or improper molting, is another common ailment for BP's, mine generally do much better when provided with a &quot;shed box&quot; when they go in opaque. For an example of a shed box , what i generally do is, go to a home improvement or garden center, purchase spaghnum moss (the real type, not peat), use a small tupperware container of some sort that can fit in your enclosure, place an inch layer of moss in the tupperware, moisten it till it's damp but not wet, place this in cage and you should be set. An alternative is simply raising humidity level during shed, but i tend to try the simpler method myself.



Entropy,
Alex

_________________
&quot;We are destined to become the most well informed society to ever die from our own ignorance.&quot;
Edward Abbey

	Boa Constrictor Imperator Boa Constrictor (Boa constrictor imperator). Most common is the Colombian Boa.

[impermanentrage]

Sorry, i failed to elaborate on leaving the top on the tupperware container with a hole larger enough for the animal to enter/exit into/from.
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[JC86]

That book is pretty good, but the guy talks more like a zoo keeper or serious breeder than a pet owner. It's good to give them a couple of weeks to adjust, but you can handle much more than 15 minutes a day.


Scott
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[Boacephus]

Good info here. I just bought a youngin myself about 3 weeks ago. They were farm hatched BP and brought to the store right after hatching. The one I picked out was nice and plump and had already had it's first shed. I only gave mine about 4 days to adjust, I knew the poor little guy had to be hungry. The first feeding was three pinkies, the following week was two fuzzies, the third was two fuzzies. I only gave mine two days after the first feeding before I started handling him, I guess I should have waited but I couldn't resist, LOL. I haven't had any real escapes until I got this little guy. He has been out twice in the past week. After the first time I fixed the problem and he simply found another one, LOL. He is now starting to go blue and is getting ready for his second shed. Good luck with your little guys.
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[slaponte]

Yeah, i read the rest of the book. A lot of the advice/comments seem directed to the wild-cought animals, or imported adults, which we all know can be a bear to get them aclimated and settled.

Boacephus, Re: your feeding schedule. I just gave them a fuzzy each since it was their first meal, day after getting here. But the two that ate didn't have a problem at all and it didn't look like they had a bulge or anything. I think I might move up to hoppers right away (by next sat).

To all, thanks for the info.
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[slaponte]

Update : doing better now. Left them alone (no unnecesary holding), separated the girls. Last two feedings everybody eats right away. The &quot;larger&quot; ones already shed, one is a little thinner, but she is starting to come along.

Today held everybody for 15/20 minutes. They all realxed out of the initial &quot;ball&quot; and started exploring and we watched TV for a while. Still very head-shy, but coming along. No strikes.

I figured quiet at feeding is the way to go. I place the fuzzy (almost hopper) in there and I leave the room. They all seem extremely distracted by noise or movement in the room.

Thanks to RTB for all the great advice. Thanks Rage for the &quot;shed box&quot; idea. Will build 3 medium sized ones this week for them. I still have them on newspaper and I don't want to get it all wet and stuff. This way they can select their humidity level.
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[LdyDrgn]

Hey Sergio!!

Just remember to wash the moss before putting it in the enclosures or hides. You don't want to introduce any buggies to your babies! Soak moss in warm/hot water, drain, repeat 2 more times working your fingers through the moss to 'wash' it. Squeeze out excess and it's ready. Wash it every now and again, for they will eliminate in the moss as well as shed. You'll be able to find the feces/urates/skin easily as you run your fingers through it during washing. Have fun with them, they sound adorable! [img]modules/Forum/images/smiles/icon_smile.gif[/img]
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[slaponte]

Update : two have shed (the ones that were eating), one hasn't yet (slimmer, was not eating until now).

After success with the fuzzies (almost hoppers), I decided this was not enough food. I found some pinky/slight fuzzy rats and ALL THREE of them ate. [img]modules/Forum/images/smiles/icon_smile.gif[/img] [img]modules/Forum/images/smiles/icon_smile.gif[/img] [img]modules/Forum/images/smiles/icon_smile.gif[/img]

Now, thats a meal! I thought for a moment they might be too big, but I made sure to get the ones with a more elongated head for easier swallowing. The body bulge was normal, noticeable (barely) so they seem fine.

Thanks again to RTB for the help ( and support in times of frustration)... [img]modules/Forum/images/smiles/icon_razz.gif[/img]
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[XzyluM]

Use the girth rule. Prey should be no bigger than the thickest part of the snake's body.
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