Puppies fed to a snake......

Stormyva · #1 (**permalink**) 09-26-2002, 01:43 AM

No I am not asking if it is ok to do this...... but supposedly the puppies that were fed to the snake were going to be euthanized the next day or so that was the story in another paper. Either way it is pretty stupid on the officers part!

Animal Control Worker Allegedly Fed Puppies To Snake
Woman Fired From Job, Could Face Charges
Posted: 10:03 a.m. EDT September 24, 2002

DETROIT -- A Detroit animal control worker accused of feeding newborn puppies to a snake has reportedly been fired and could face criminal charges, WDIV-TV reported Tuesday.

Officials at the Detroit Health Department, which oversees the city's animal control center, said that the snake has been placed in an unidentified shelter in Ohio. The snake is believed to be a large python that was confiscated during a police raid.

DHD officials said the department will turn the findings of its investigation over to the Wayne County prosecutor, who may bring charges. The worker could face charges ranging from animal cruelty to abuse of her position.

"Of course this is not something we condone. We absolutely cannot allow people to do things that are not in keeping with the way we do business," said Judith West of the DHD.

DHD officials would not confirm the number of puppies that may have been fed to the snake or how many feedings took place. Department officials said that other animal control workers reportedly witnessed the feedings.

Those workers are not likely to be charged.
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storm · #2 (**permalink**) 09-26-2002, 02:44 AM

[img]modules/Forum/images/smiles/icon_eek.gif[/img] Geez, are colossal rats and bunnies just getting too expensive now? Well, if that doesn't reflect poorly on the rest of the herp community, i don't know what does. [img]modules/Forum/images/smiles/icon_evil.gif[/img]
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najaboy · #3 (**permalink**) 09-26-2002, 03:03 AM

I don't see this one having too much of a negative impact on us, aside from the snake being confiscated from a drug dealer.

The media here in Detroit is justifiably presenting it as an abuse of position by the animal control worker.
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snaklover · #4 (**permalink**) 09-26-2002, 03:16 AM

I agree I too dont see to much negative impact on herpers..But boy is the animal control officer in some deep do-do.. [img]modules/Forum/images/smiles/icon_lol.gif[/img]
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trinitywolf · #5 (**permalink**) 09-26-2002, 03:41 AM

America's not ready to see anyone feeding puppies to a snake, but the fact that a person who is supposed to care for animals did it makes it worse. I agree with Ken though...I don't see reptile keepers taking a lot of heat for this. This one falls all on the shoulders of the person who actually fed those puppies to the snake.
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Ritchie · #6 (**permalink**) 09-26-2002, 03:47 AM

The courts will pronounce her guilty and send her to Jail

I mean...why let a snake kill the puppies and use it for nourishment thus completeing the circle of life...

Why do that when we can (as human beings) kill the puppies our selves and throw them in the trash to fill up the land fills. Or incinerate them and cause more polution.

Why because we are stupid human beings.
It is okay for us to shoot up the puppies with poison and waste it...
But it is not okay for a poython to use it to help itself live better by aqcuiring nourishment form it.

It is inhumane to feed it to a snake but it is completely okay to shoot it up.....or just twist its neck (yes some people do this)
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talon · #7 (**permalink**) 09-26-2002, 05:28 AM

if the puppies were sentenced to death why not? I could see "Pre killing" them first to be humane but if it was a rat, pig, cow, raccoon anything we eat, hunt, or feel is a pest it is ok. I feel that this is bullS*t. different ethnicities eat dogs why can't snakes? so many cats and dogs are put to sleep why let that biomass go to waste. I would donate my body for something to eat it after i was dead. WHO CARES! its going to die let some thing else live from it!

Sorry for affending anybody. I feel strongly about this, and i know other people feel the other way. I DO NOT AND WILL NOT FEED MY SNAKES CATS, DOGS ETC. so don't get me wrong but you need to see it from the other side too
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Joltman · #8 (**permalink**) 09-26-2002, 05:40 AM

You know I can see both side of the story. The dogs were going to put to sleep the next day. I my self could not find it in my heart to feed a puppy to a snake. It is hard enough to feed a rabbit to them. I feel that the person was in the wrong 100%. she is representing a place the is supposed to be taking care of these animals not making them snake food. I hope the put the girl in jail and fine the doo doo out of her.
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mirabelasunshine · #9 (**permalink**) 09-26-2002, 05:45 AM

Interesting debate. I suppose I want to know a little bit more, like was she feeding them out of a sense of 'don't let this biomass go to waste,' or for sadistic thrills, etc. In the end I suppose it's the same, though -- the snake got something that nobody else would have anyway, so why not... There are so many really great things to be outraged about, why bother with that.
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Dr.Oviparous · #10 (**permalink**) 10-02-2002, 09:39 AM

<TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD><font class="pn-sub">Quote:</font><HR></TD></TR><TR><TD><FONT class="pn-sub"><BLOCKQUOTE>I suppose I want to know a little bit more, like was she feeding them out of a sense of 'don't let this biomass go to waste,' or for sadistic thrills, etc. </BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE> I'll second this. Personally I do not see anything whatsoever wrong with feeding puppies (or anything else for that matter) to snakes. Besides the lower nutritional value. What in the world is the difference between feeding a puppy to a snake or a rat? There is only one answer: most people like puppies better. Does that make it a crime to feed a snake a puppy, just because most people like them more? NO.

The one thing that BLOWS MY MIND is that people care a lot more about what was fed to the snake, than about the matter in which it was fed. There was no mention about whether the puppies were fed live to the snake to suffer through the whole process of asphyxiation, or if they were put down quietly and painlessly. [img]modules/Forum/images/smiles/icon_mad.gif[/img] .

Grrr, I'm getting all worked up here. It really just does not make any sense to me why someone would be against feeding puppies to snakes. Again, nutritional content aside.

I would bet anyone cold hard cash that if one snake was fed a live rat, and another was fed a euthanized puppy both in public view, people in general would be much more upset about the puppy. Does that make any sense what so ever?

Is there some difference between a rodent's nervous system, and a puppies to where a rat does not feel pain, and a puppy does? No, they both feel pain the same way so why in the world is it ethically wrong to feed a puppy to a snake, and not a rat?

Pressing charges against this women?!?!?! WTF!! [img]modules/Forum/images/smiles/icon_mad.gif[/img] That would royally P*ss me off if they went through with that, and not prosecuted the people that feed live rodents. [img]modules/Forum/images/smiles/icon_evil.gif[/img] . (I'm not talking about the people that feed very picky snakes, like BPs for instance, live prey because it is all they will eat after months of trying to get them on F/T or P/K)

I've got more to say, But I'll save it. I've already written a novel here, lol. Thanks to every body that actually read it [img]modules/Forum/images/smiles/icon_smile.gif[/img] . This topic just kind of gets me worked up because it can be kind of hard to find "feeder" bunnies down here in this small town even though two of the 4 pet shops here sell bunnies for pets, they won't sell them for feeders at any price. Keep in mind these shops DO sell feeder mice/rats. and they DO SELL Burmese pythons. GRRR, WTF. [img]modules/Forum/images/smiles/icon_evil.gif[/img] -Juggalo

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SilverTongue · #11 (**permalink**) 10-02-2002, 10:45 AM

Here is teh Link to the story http://www.freep.com/news/locway/pups24_20020924.htm

<TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD><font class="pn-sub">Quote:</font><HR></TD></TR><TR><TD><FONT class="pn-sub"><BLOCKQUOTE>The department is planning to broaden its mission of keeping strays and dangerous animals off city streets to include handling them with compassion, West said. </BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE>
UMMMMM WHY THE F**K WERNT THEY DOING THIS IN THE FIRST PLACE!
I CAN NOT BELIEVE THE STUPIDITY OF PEOPLE. tHOUGH I DO NOT CONDONE THE FEEDING OF PUPPIES TO REPTILES BECAUSE I PERSONALLY LOVE WELL EVERYTHING BUT YUCKY BUGS, AND STUPID PEOPLE!
BUT IT IS REALLY NO DIFFERENT THEN FEEDING IT A BUNNIE OR A RAT OR A GOAT OR WHATEVER. IT IS JUST SOME PEOPLE VALUE THE LIFE OF PUPPIES OVER RATS. I TEND TO AGREE BUT THAT IS JUST MY OPINION. IT DOES NOT MAKE IT RIGHT.
YES I AGREE THE B*TCH WAS VERY STUPID 1 FOR FEEDING THE PUPPIES TO THE SNAKE (MY PERSONAL OPINION. DEAL WITH IT!)
2 THE FACT THAT SHE DID THIS INFRONT OF OTHER PEOPLE PROVES THAT THIS IS EITHER A ONGOING THING OR SHE WAS JUST SHOWING OFF!

IF I WAS GOD I WOULD VETO THE HUMAN RACE!

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Dr.Oviparous · #12 (**permalink**) 10-02-2002, 11:40 AM

<TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD><font class="pn-sub">Quote:</font><HR></TD></TR><TR><TD><FONT class="pn-sub"><BLOCKQUOTE> Investigators say charges could range from felony animal cruelty </BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE> OMG, that is a total LOAD OF CRAP!

<TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD><font class="pn-sub">Quote:</font><HR></TD></TR><TR><TD><FONT class="pn-sub"><BLOCKQUOTE> The city also sells animals to dealers who then sell them to researchers </BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE> Hmmmmm..... I'd like to hear a lot more about that! Alright, I'm going to stop here this time [img]modules/Forum/images/smiles/icon_evil.gif[/img]

_________________

"Well, it didn't look like a one horse town, but try finding a decent hair jelly!" -Eulisses E McGill

Stormyva · #13 (**permalink**) 10-02-2002, 01:59 PM

I agree that a puppy is just as good a food source as anything else that migh slide past a snakes lips..... I also think it is absolutely rediculous that the poor animal control worker is getting the shaft on this one. If she had fed the rescued snake a rat or a rabbit or a guinea pig, all of which are easily found in most SPCA's in the US she would not have been reprimanded at all.
I think it is 100% BS that they are suffering like this.

Maybe we should all unite on this one and bombard the yo-yo people up there in MI that are trying to prosecute this person...... I will see if I can come up with some email addy's!
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Stormyva · #14 (**permalink**) 10-02-2002, 02:29 PM

I think this address should work......( westj@health.ci.detroit.mi.us )

That SHOULD be for Judith West, the director of Detroit Health which appears to have the Animal Control under it's jurisdiction.

westj@health.ci.detroit.mi.us

It is amazing to me that the way an animal is looked at by the general population determines how a person is getting treated. If that animal control officer took rabbits, rats, or guinea pigs that are probably all over the Detroit SPCA then this whole situation would not be happening.
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eddie · #15 (**permalink**) 10-02-2002, 03:31 PM

I think the officer should be charged with it as a crime.

Now I will explain.

In most shelters that haveanimals such as rabbits, mice, puppies etc, the animals were drop offs that are usually set up to be adopted out OR put to sleep.
To not do either is a violation of the law.

As an example, in NC, if the AC has rabbits or mice for adoption and they find out later that they were use dfor food, you can be charged with it as abuse and neglect.

As for it being the same as pet store bought food, it isn't.
Feeders in pet stores are usually the lesser quality and inbred stock intended as feeders and not as pets.

If animals are sent to or dropped at the shelters, then they MUST be treated EXACTLY as the laws and their policies dictate.
If their policy is to adopt out what they can, then they must be adopted out.
If tyheir policy is to euthanize it and sell it for research, then it MUST be done also.
Any violation of the policies and or laws in effect should result in swift but fair punishment for the offenders.
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eddie · #16 (**permalink**) 10-02-2002, 03:43 PM

Another example that happened here in NC.

About 1991 I had applied to the Gaston county AC and went to several siminars with them at the time.

One of the instructers told a story about her early days with AC.

A momma dog had died and the puppies were dropped off at the shelter and scheduled for the needle in the heart as they were just born and without having the momma to feed them they were going to die anyway.
The instructer took the puppies home, without telling anyone and tried to care for them.
They all died slowly due to her not being their round the clock for feedings.
For punishment, she was held back for her first promotion and also had to personally euthanize EVERY small puppy, kitten whatever came in that had to be given the needle in the heart.

She learned her lessons on life and got off easy, without being charged with cruelty and went on to become one of their better instructers.

Point is, she got off easy due to her prior perfect record AND that she was trying to save a few lives instead of showboating like the officer this thread is about did.
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najaboy · #17 (**permalink**) 10-02-2002, 07:40 PM

Being a native Detroiter, I'm privy to a bit more insight on this issue than most people.

Yes, this woman does deserve to be prosecuted. To begin with, she violated a federal statute. Dogs are afforded legal protections under tha AWA that are not necessarily entended to other animals such as rodents.

Additionally, she'd still be in hot water if she fed any other type of live shelter animal to the python. It still amounts to abuse of position. Had she used an already euthanized animal that wasn't slated to be otherwised utilized, she might have a legally defensable position.

Also, this isn't a case of offering a snake a missed meal; her motive was sadistic curiosity, much like the kids who tied a firecracker to the neck of a stray German shepherd puppy. Make no mistake, she didn't care about the snake being hungry or providing it a meal. She was merely interested in the "thrill of the kill".

As for animals being sold for purposes of research, that is true of most animal shelters. The way things go in Detroit is... the animals are purchased from the shelter by USDA certified dealers. Most are then resold to Wayne State University's School of Medicine. Others make their way to other universities around the country. Still others are euthanized and preserved.

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pincess_wy · #18 (**permalink**) 10-02-2002, 07:55 PM

As an aside.... can someone explain to me why the other workers who witnessed the act are not facing consequences, as well? I would just think that if you observe misconduct in the workplace, you are supposed to report it.
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