Steve Irwin, Friend or Foe?

[Countryboy]

Has anybody thought about dropping him a e mail expressing theses concerns, and what impacts he is having on the public and hot community? I love watching him but I would still watch him if he used the proper equipment? The only thing is that if he does start using a hook and everytone see's him and all the other people using them are we gonna have a bunch of idiots running around with hooks thinking thinking they are safe now because they have a hook. This was a great post BW long but worth the time to read it.
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[gecko_paws]

I would never want to keep a venomous snake ever! I just like watching the shows and watching educators that come around locally at zoos or whatever teaching us about them. I just like to admire them for their beauty and would never keep one as a pet. Snakes like that belong in the wild.
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[Ed_r]

<TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD><font class="pn-sub">Quote:</font><HR></TD></TR><TR><TD><FONT class="pn-sub"><BLOCKQUOTE>Maybe they need to sell TV's with warning labels </BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE>

J I think you hit the nail on the head on that one. #$%^&#$%^&#$%^&#$%^& i bout my son a bike and they made me sign a release that I wouldn't sue the store if something happened to him.
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[telefrag]

I wonder if mr &quot;croc hunter&quot; got bit fatally while filming his show, if they would air it.

its bound to happen some day.
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[SteveP]

I've wondered that myself! One of these days will we read an article about Steve Irwin having been fataly tagged...it could happen. I like the guy, as well as the others, for bringing a better awareness of the (natural) reptilian world to the general public...but knowledge can be a Pandoras box, always has, always will be!

I think of the times I've been tagged by my boas, and then imagine if it were a &quot;hot&quot; snake...makes me shudder. I know people think that I am nuts for keeping those &quot;enormous, man-eating boas&quot;...so there's a thrill factor associated with them as well. The sad part about inexperienced people going out and getting hot-snakes, besides the life threatening aspect to the keeper, is that once the thrill has worn off will it be cared for or ignored and therefore neglected. I've known owners of pitbulls (never owned other dogs before) that show off their big, bad-a__ dog, then once the friends and neighbors who were once afraid don't pay any attention anymore the dog gets relegated to a backyard full of feces and is ignored, lucky to be fed. Not only will publicized bites by venemous snakes get public attention and load the guns of the SPCA, PETA and other organizations, but animal neglect by stupid people will allow negative regulations for all herps to hit the bullseye.
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[BWSmith]

I don't hink that it is so much a metter of poor hunsbandry for venomous once &quot;the thrill&quot; has worn off. That can happen with any animal. I think, with venomous, there sometimes is a more laxadasicle aproach. People deal with them every day and some people forget thier true capabilities. Neglect of the animals is a definate issue, but I don't think that it is the primary issue that should be addressed and should be our focus to protect our hobby. I must say again, education. Even if it a simple as stopping someone from buying a heat rock for thier ball python in a pet shop and explaining why they kill snakes. That alone could change the fate a snake. Everyone is going to have thier own opinions on hots and hot keepers. That is what I love about this forum. Everyone respects everyone elses opinions and we don't tend to start flame wars over differences. We generally turn it into a good clean debate. It is obvious that this issue bothers me and I see the situation as a call to arms to protect ourselves and our animals. There is not just one solution though. We need to let Steve and Animal Planet know our concerns, we need to address immoral dealers, and we need to educate the public and our fellow herpers. And that is just the first step on the road to a solution longer than Route 66.
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	Venomous Reptile A term commonly used to refer to a venomous reptile. Most commonly used in reference to venomous snakes.

[snakester]

I agree with BW even though we don't keep hots. They are beautiful but I admire them from afar. People are dumb and will do what they see on t.v. it's happened time and time again. Where we live in southeast kansas if the word snake is mentioned it's automatically a bad snake. The snake will kill us in our sleep and other crap. We do try to educate the people here but it's an uphill battle. Some are willing to listen but most aren't. But anyway we keep trying to educate the idiots that think rtbs will get us in our sleep or that kill every snake they see outdoors.

I do think that Steve Irwin needs to think about his affect on people since he's in the public eye so much. I do applaud him for his efforts but even he needs to realize his impact on people.

Even though I'm relatively new to herping, I don't want my right to keep snakes taken away because of idiots.
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[Ravnos]

Personally, I dislike all the 'herp' shows. They sensationalize, and seek to shock for the purpose of tv ratings and money. The education is secondary, and not even completely accurate much of the time. They spend huge amounts of time pushing the shock value species and completely ignore many truly fascinating animals. If I see another tv herper going after king cobras, I'll vomit. They show themselves in silly situations, magically coming across animals in the wild, and improperly handling and then talking about how stressed and #$%^&#$%^&#$%^&#$%^&#$%^&#$%^& off the animal is and how nobody should ever do what they are doing.

Don't get me wrong, I do enjoy the fact that they are getting these animals into the mainstream, so people are familiar with them - but they are doing little to actually educate, or asway people's fears, if anything they're playing off of them for the shock value of the shows. I do commend Steve Irwin on his conservation efforts and his work at his zoo... I think that Mark O'Shea is delving into areas of herpetological research that are really long over due for attention. Jeff Corwin has been involved with several conservation and education groups since he was a kid. I just think shock-tv and making jokes about it is the wrong way to go about it, and it helps no one.

As for the second thread... keeping hots is a personal decision. I don't believe educating others is a necessary part of being able to keep, care for, and appreciate venomous animals of any type. Personally, I keep hots because I enjoy the animals. They are fascinating and beautiful. Same reason I keep all my other animals - personal education. I do know there are people out there who only get a venomous snake for their own personal shock value, to show to others and say &quot;Look what I have, aren't you impressed?!&quot; and there are dealers that subsist off of this type of client. Those people who have a table at a show loaded with 35 dollar baby gaboon vipers are a perfect example.

Anyway... I don't think the increase in number of incidents in the media has anything to do with Steve Irwin specifically or with these type of tv shows in general. I think it simply has to do with the increased (and increasing) ease of aquiring said animals, and most certainly the lack of responsibility on the end of sellers, buyers, and even people wandering around in the wild and coming across these animals. Of course, the increase of media attention because of HSUS's blind ignorance and so forth doesn't help anyone... because they will always focus on the bad things. I don't think a reporter would ever show up at someone's door to say &quot;So you are a responsible reptile keeper, lets do a story on you.&quot; Its just not shocking enough to get headlines. In the end, it comes down to personal responsibility. For everyone, not just the sellers, not just the buyers, but the general public as well - for ignorance is the worst possible sin.

Sorry... long winded and veered around a bit. =)

Rav
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	Venomous Reptile A term commonly used to refer to a venomous reptile. Most commonly used in reference to venomous snakes.

[Dragon]

Any &quot;Celebrity&quot; has a responsibility to his audience. If Steve Irwin free-handles HOTs then he is setting a bad example, end of story. He shouldn't be doing it. What is he trying to prove? I hope to #$%^&#$%^&#$%^&#$%^& that he gets tagged one day, it just might teach him a lesson that he so obviously needs to learn. I don't care if he's immortal and has had 500 years experience keeping a million and one HOTs, he should not set examples that may lead idiots to emulate him. A disclaimer is no excuse either. People are stupid and tend to ignore disclaimers. If we were responsible beings capable of rationalizing danger and making educated decisions, there would be no such thing as the Darwinian awards.


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	Venomous Reptile A term commonly used to refer to a venomous reptile. Most commonly used in reference to venomous snakes.

[Ed_r]

It's a wonderful thing when all of us can speak intellegently about a sticky subject like this. And Not one insult tossed in amongst it. Ya'll are a class act!!! [img]modules/Forum/images/smiles/icon_smile.gif[/img]
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