Garter snakes

[muzixman]

I was reading this and wondered what everyone thought???

The American Garters,(Thamnophis) are evolving toward having rear fangs & venom. The teeth in the top rear are enlarged. This is probably due to their diet of amphibians such as toads which inflate themselves when being swallowed. I have read seemingly accurate accounts of people showing more than normal reaction to being bitten by Thamnophis. The saliva is probably slightly toxic. All of the above is also true of genus Heterodon, the Hognosed Snakes, which also prey upon toads.

[Ed_r]

For frog eaters its a necessity to have larger teeth . Mainly because when a frog is being eaten the only defense it has is to puff itself up with air. The enlarged teeth(fangs) serve to puncture the frog to deflate it.

Garter snakes do have an anticoagulant in their saliva. Not quite considered toxic, but not completely harless either. Some people do get reactions to garter snake bites. I got bit on the lip by a garter and I bled like crazy and my lip swelled up pretty good too. Nothing serious, but there was a slight reaction.

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[Ravnos]

Why were you sucking face with a garter Ed?

The englarged teeth are more just to hang on to otherwise slippery prey items. I think that article oversimplifies garter snakes "venom" and could be taken in a very bad way, especially by those who would like to see the herp hobby disappear. Anyway, regardless, to my knowledge there has been no recorded instance of a significant/life threatening reaction to either garters or hognose bites and thus should be considered harmless to humans. It just scares me to think what the ignorant could do with a phrase like 'garter snakes are venomous' written by a PhD.

Rav

[muzixman]

I was going to go out and cut the grass but theres a lot of garters around here I can see the headlines in the local paper now "Local man dies from snake bite" LOL

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[Ed_r]

Why were you sucking face with a garter Ed?

Well if you must ask she was quite purdy, and i was in a slump.LOL j/k I was cleaning her cage and had her in the other hand while cleaning and had her too close to my face and she desided to bite me.lol

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[captainmorgan]

I have no clue on that. I know I caught a couple this past weekend and he crapped all over me. Didn't smell to hot either....wouldn't that be something if garters evolved into poisonous snakes. Talk about doing a 180 on the food chain. I'd feel bad for the first predator to find out the hard way by getting bit.....Imagine that on your tombstone. Man dies by garter snake bite.

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[John_White]

Originally Posted by Ed_r

For frog eaters its a necessity to have larger teeth . Mainly because when a frog is being eaten the only defense it has is to puff itself up with air. The enlarged teeth(fangs) serve to puncture the frog to deflate it.

If you referring to hognose snakes (Heterodon): Fairly recent studies have found that the enlarged teeth are too short to deflate the toad; instead they channel venom in to the bite and the envenomation relaxes the toad for easy swallowing.

[John_White]

Not a serious envenomation, but:
Hayes and Hayes (1985) report on the case of a 13-year old child that was envenomated by an eastern garter snake. The child was hospitalized following development of coolness, edema, and ecchymosis of the bitten hand. Vital signs and lab values were normal and the kid recovered.

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[Ed_r]

Hmm Ok Cool learn something new every day

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[herpkingdom]

i can see it now.......
Good old Steve himself on the hunt for the elusive, highly venomous Eastern Garter Snake from North America,,,,

He grabs it by the tail and it swings up and bites him on the nose! :P

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[Gecko-Guy]

CRIKEY!!! It's really #$%^&#$%^&#$%^&#$%^&#$%^&#$%^& off now! <Australian accent>

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[BWSmith]

I just had my first experience of a Garter chewing on my finger for a full 5-8 seconds. They can get a little bit of jaw pressure when they want to

[schatzie001]

Originally Posted by captainmorgan

....wouldn't that be something if garters evolved into poisonous snakes.

That could never happen. Venomous maybe, poisonous, naw :P

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[Ed_r]

I just had my first experience of a Garter chewing on my finger for a full 5-8 seconds

Was it flossing?

[eddie]

My dad always said that a garter would make you sick.
Maybe this is what he meant.

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[muzixman]

well I have been bitten by them with no ill effect, they seem to be a little more snippy than they were when I was a kid, as a kid I never was bitten by one now I remove one from my yard to mow and bammm lol

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[BWSmith]

Update. After over a week, all of the sudden bumps are forming on the Garter bite. hmmmm.

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[John_White]

poison ivy?

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[BWSmith]

Nope. Not allergic to poison ivy or poison oak. Actually, i have not found anything that I am really allergic to. I pulled 10 ticks off this past weekend and 2 are swollen up pretty good right now (yes, I got the heads). Perhaps that has somethign to do with it. **shrug** oddness.

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[eddie]

Could be a low grade infection.. I get them every so often from small wounds.
usually, tighness, reddness and some swelling occur till I lance and squeeze till I see plain blood coming out.

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