Feeding Location Questions

dave7205@att.net · #1 (**permalink**) 07-30-2010, 07:30 PM

Hello, as always you guys have been a source of great knowlege, but anyway I have seen this discussed but don't remember where, so here goes, please excuse me for repeating. I have a 2 year old female boa, Almost 5 feet, I was told yesterday that I need to start feeding her out of her enclosure, as she will get testy, but I have also heard others say it doesn't matter. Any thoughts or reasons behind this to clarify the "Why" would be great. As always, thanks in advance. Sheila

B-Spec · #2 (**permalink**) 07-30-2010, 07:35 PM

Well I am no expert... but my boa isnt even 1 yr yet and I feed her in a seperate box. A moving box. The same one every time.

Word on the street is they think its feeding time everytime their top opens if u feed in the enclosure.

my .02

morti · #3 (**permalink**) 07-30-2010, 07:40 PM

We feed in the enclosures for a variety of reasons.

1) We have a lot of snakes. Really lots. It would be goofy to try feeding them all in separate enclosures.

2) I think removing snakes for feeding adds stress at the time that they need it the least.

3) I don't buy into the whole cage conditioning thing.

4) Simple is usually better in every aspect of keeping reptiles.

B-Spec · #4 (**permalink**) 07-30-2010, 07:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by morti

We feed in the enclosures for a variety of reasons.

1) We have a lot of snakes. Really lots. It would be goofy to try feeding them all in separate enclosures.

2) I think removing snakes for feeding adds stress at the time that they need it the least.

3) I don't buy into the whole cage conditioning thing.

4) Simple is usually better in every aspect of keeping reptiles.

For those of us with only a couple... Is it frowned apon to fed seperate?

I wait 30-40 min till she is trying to escape from the feeding box to move her... Seems to be working fine.

dave7205@att.net · #5 (**permalink**) 07-30-2010, 07:51 PM

Thankyou as always for the great insight.

Rachel SS · #6 (**permalink**) 07-30-2010, 07:52 PM

It's not frowned upon but it is really pointless. As stated, it stresses the snake out more and once the snake smells rat they can and probably will bite you. A bite from a baby boa? Not bad at all. A bite from a 6 foot hungry boa? Not a thrilling experience.

RioBravoReptiles · #7 (**permalink**) 07-30-2010, 07:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by B-Spec

.. Word on the street is they think its feeding time everytime their top opens if u feed in the enclosure...

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.. well, don't feed in the street!

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But if that's true.. then wouldn't it also be true that if you always move them to feed them that they would think you are feeding them every time they are taken out of their cage?
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I think boas are smarter than that.. they know when they are being fed by a combination of factors, including the odor of prey and so-on.
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And people are smarter than boas.. they can learn how to avoid being bitten by their boas.. That's the dominant factor in human-reptile interaction.. Not 'training' a snake with a brain pan the size of a split pea!
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That's my opinion on that...

morti · #8 (**permalink**) 07-30-2010, 07:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by B-Spec

For those of us with only a couple... Is it frowned apon to fed seperate?
I wait 30-40 min till she is trying to escape from the feeding box to move her... Seems to be working fine.

If #1 doesn't apply to you, see 2 - 4.

This is not a frowning matter... it is a difference of opinion.

B-Spec · #9 (**permalink**) 07-30-2010, 08:00 PM

Hey i'm always learning new things...

I would love to feed my boa in the cage... but I like taking her out a bunch... I guess I should try it while she is under 4ft..

nitram · #10 (**permalink**) 07-30-2010, 08:11 PM

im far from a pro on the matter. but i think, besides what morti mentioned (which are good on their own), there are an addional 2 reasons i dont do it.
1 is after they eat, my boas stay in that feeding agressive mode, i think chances of being bit are higher once their feeding response is triggered. and this is while they have a nice lump in their bellies, so i know theyve had enough, i dont think they do. if not by feeding response, i think theyre more 'fiesty' at this time because this is when theyre most voulnerable, so it'd be when they're most defensive in my opinion.
#2 is risk of a regurge and possible intestinal damage by applying pressure by handling. its like if you were full and someone grabbed you by the gut and started moving you around, id probly puke all over the place lol.
i dont buy into the conditioning thing either, i think they know when its feeding time and when its handling time. besides, if they were in fact being conditioned they'd also be conditioned to the idea everytime they're handled, its feeding time. does that make sense? anyway, i feed in the enclosure only, and wont feed if i had to handle them to clean cause they made a mess or something, i'll wait a bit after interracting with them to feed. i think thats the best way for them to not associate your hands with food.

B-Spec · #11 (**permalink**) 07-30-2010, 08:20 PM

Well I am perplexed.

Sakara · #12 (**permalink**) 07-30-2010, 08:24 PM

it's just easier to feed in cage. allows for less stress because you don't have to bug the boa after it eats. the snake can just relax and go to it's hot spot to digest. i see no point in bothering the animal what so ever after it eats.

I've never had a problem with an aggressive animal when it's not feeding day. they know the difference. they deff. aren't dumb lol.

Sakara · #13 (**permalink**) 07-30-2010, 08:25 PM

oh, I forgot... I use tongs to feed mine. 18 inchers. they see rat and tongs. not rat in hand

I'm sure that helps a little

RioBravoReptiles · #14 (**permalink**) 07-30-2010, 09:14 PM

The only real purpose that comes to mind to routinely move a boa before feeding would be if it is kept in a complicated enclosure with lots of gadgets or whatever that would be possibly disturbed or 'involved' in the feeding process..
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But I want to clarify that there's a lot of leeway in how to keep and raise boas and it's results that count, not small specifics of technique like whether or not to move Boas for feeding..
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If your boa is happy and healthy and you are happy and healthy then you're doing a top job.. the details are not so important..
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Yet there are specific indicators of health and vigor in boas that are not debatable.. Those include but are not limited to (in no particular order)..
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Freedom from disease, parasites and injury..
Normal strength, mobility and attentiveness.
Uniform stools lacking bad odors and more characteristic of problems.
Growth, at a rate complimentary to it's age, environment and feeding.
Few or no signs of stress or fear..
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Feeding.. the act of a boa feeding, the anticipation of it and the preparations for it (selecting and buying the meal, defrosting or otherwise preparing it or planning for the 'event') are a big part of how many keepers, especially entry-level keepers, interact with their boa pets.. Just look at all the posts and threads dealing with this!
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If moving the animal prior to feeding helps or adds to the experience (for the keeper) and can be done with no problems for the snake.. then why not? Though it's a near certainty from the vantage point of many years of working with Boas and many other reptiles that the evidence of any benefits is flimsy at best..
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Bottom line.. if YOU do this and it brings no problems and you believe it helps then that might be enough of a reason to do it and recommend it. After all it's the success of the union of reptile and human that is the goal and anything, real or imagined, that brings positive results should be considered.
Just rambling!

M2788 · #15 (**permalink**) 07-30-2010, 10:53 PM

Personally, I have tried feeding both in and out of the enclosure over the years and have seen no noticeable differences in temperament either way. My reluctant to bite snakes are still reluctant to bite, and my grumpier snakes still cheerfully try to eat me whenever I stick my hand in the terrarium. The only reason that I ever feed a snake out of the enclosure is if it is at a serious risk of substrate ingestion, I.E. my Eryx colubrinus loveridgei that are kept on about 2 ½ inches of play sand. My male in particular likes to drag his prey under the substrate and eat it there, and given that I feed frozen/thawed as I am sure you can imagine the sand sticks like crazy to the rodent. If that isn’t a concern, I personally see no good reason to feed out of the enclosure, but to each his/her own.

Aquarius · #16 (**permalink**) 08-03-2010, 04:52 AM

For people concerned about the snake becoming snippy, I had someone(on here actually) who said they laid down news paper every time they were feeding. It stops the snake from swallowing any substrate but also makes them associate the newspaper with feeding instead of the cage opening.

Jeremy2792 · #17 (**permalink**) 08-03-2010, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RioBravoReptiles

Uniform stools lacking bad odors and more characteristic of problems.

Gus, I just wanted to pull this out of your post because I had a question. When you say, Uniform Stools, what exactly do you mean by that? My BCC and BCI both generally have 2 toned stools. I would say 3/4 is brown and 1/4 is white and powedery looking.

You say, "Lacking Bad Odors" when my snakes pass their stools, they are almost unbareable and I gag everytime I have to pull it out of the cage. I always catch it within atleast 8 hours of them passing stool. I keep my snakes in Cocoa Fiber, everyday after work the first thing I check is their cages for stools and/or dirty water. If they pass in the in cocoa fiber and not their water dish. I use a Latex Gloves to scoop it out and throw it into the garbage. I can tell you that I gag every single time I am walking my happy

to the bathroom with snake poo. I am not sure if I am just sensitive to the odor of stool in general, but I can tell you it doesn't smell pretty, at all.

My Suriname likes to go in her waterdish, and my BCI likes to go on his cocoa fiber in the corner and generally is on the opposite side of where ever he decides to go.

Not that I ever over analyzed this situation at all. It's poop, it smells so I never thought twice about it until I saw this post.

Your help/input is greatly appreciated.

Derekcm87 · #18 (**permalink**) 08-03-2010, 07:58 PM

I used to feed in a seperate enclosure because I have always heard that if you feed in their enclosure they will associate the cage opening with time to eat. I asked the same question on here when I joined and someone put it to me like this and this is what opened my eyes and made me change the way I do it. If they are smart enough to associate the opening of the cage with time to eat then what makes you think they wont associate you trying to put them into a seperate container with feeding. Who wants to hav an adult boa in the arms when they realize they are going into the container and its time to eat. NOT ME! Oh and all the reasons about stress ect stated above too. All my snakes seem to stay in feed mode for quiet some time (a few hours?) Especially my boa and retic, I can walk into the room hours after feeding just for a second and they are both stalking very hard. Why leave them in a seperate container for that long or longer to assure they are not gonna tag you. I dont know about you but for me it wouldnt work, I am home from work around 6 at night, If its a feeding day, by the time I get done cooking, eating, letting the dogs out. cleaning up snake poop, playing with the snakes, spending time with the wife then feed, If i wait for them to be out of feed mode before tranfering them back it'd b 1 in the morning and I have to get up in 4 hours. So those are my reasons.

dave7205@att.net · #19 (**permalink**) 08-04-2010, 07:22 AM

Again, thankyou all very much for all the great advice. I have wondered about all the stuff you each helped me address and eliminate for my reasons to move her or not to move her at feeding time. I have not been tagged yet, knock on wood, but no reason I should mess with what ain't broke.

HERPHAPPY · #20 (**permalink**) 08-04-2010, 07:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aquarius

For people concerned about the snake becoming snippy, I had someone(on here actually) who said they laid down news paper every time they were feeding. It stops the snake from swallowing any substrate but also makes them associate the newspaper with feeding instead of the cage opening.

I think that is Star who feeds on newspaper? And I've used paper plates now and then, or putting their food in a shallow box, to keep them from swallowing substrate...it all works!

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