Ball Python not moving!

xenomorph · #1 (**permalink**) 12-01-2003, 12:32 AM

Okay, here's the whole story. We found mites on our bp yesterday and tried to treat him today. We did the following:
1. let him soak in room temperature water while we
2. removed everything from his tank and sprayed it with permanone
3. we then wiped him down with a solution of nix and water then
4. wiped out the tank after drying several hours and tried to put him back
When we put him into the tank he started yawning, so we figured the fumes might still be too much so we took him back out. He wasn't in there for more then a few minutes. Since then, he has become more and more lethargic. I placed him on his back and he couldn't right himself. We decided to let him soak again in case the nix was too strong, but this hasn't helped. He is just lying in a tuperware container and not flicking his tongue or moving. I don't want to do anything else too him as he is stressed enough, but I am afraid he is in really bad shape. Is there anything I can do to help him? Please help!!

xenomorph · #2 (**permalink**) 12-01-2003, 03:49 PM

Update. We soaked him for a while last night thinking maybe the nix was too strong for him but there wasn't much improvement and we were worried he wouldn't make it through the night. We put him in his tank and let him rest for fear we were stressing him, said prayers for him and left him alone. Gradually, he started to come around. I saw him exploring his tank in the middle of the night and flicking his tongue so I am optimistic. Today he seems to have more muscle control and slithers around when I hold him. Still, for the most part, he is just resting. Is there anything else I can do besides let him be? Thanks for any help you can give.

Amiechan · #3 (**permalink**) 12-01-2003, 04:02 PM

We never spray or use anything directly on the snake.
Anytime we have gotten mites, we have used Sawyers spray (odorless type). We clean their enclosures with soapy water, rinse well, take out water bowls, put down new newspaper, spray the enclosure, then put the snake in. Usually within 24 hours there are no mites left. We then reclean the enclosures, put down new newspaper and put the water bowls back in.
Sometimes we will put sevin dust on the carpet in the snakeroom.

eddie · #4 (**permalink**) 12-01-2003, 04:21 PM

Nix has permethrin as an active ingredient, which in direct contact with reptiles, can cause a range of neurological problems from lethargy to seizures up to and including death.
Sounds like you may have gotten off lucky this time, but in the future, remember, NO chemicals, no matter how watered down, should be put directly on the snake.

There are some exceptions to this however, but anything permethrin based is a no no.

xenomorph · #5 (**permalink**) 12-01-2003, 04:56 PM

I got the instructions on what we did from the book "Pythons A Complete Pet Owners Manual". I can't believe we almost lost him. I am still sick over it. He still isn't quite himself. He has moved into his hide now which is more normal for him then laying in the open like he was doing. I hope he is feeling better. Would you suggest any more soaks? Also, he is due for a feeding tomorrow. Should I hold off or feed as normal? Thanks for the feedback.

eddie · #6 (**permalink**) 12-01-2003, 05:24 PM

I would soak him again, just to get him drinking so that the internal residue from the permethrins can hopefully be purged from him a little quicker.

I don't think a skipped meal will hurt him either, just to prevent his system from working on digestion verses ridding itself of the chems.

themoononastick · #7 (**permalink**) 12-01-2003, 05:24 PM

hope the little fella gets better soon.

xenomorph · #8 (**permalink**) 12-01-2003, 05:41 PM

Quote:

Sounds like you may have gotten off lucky this time,

We may have stumbled accross a name for him finally, Lucky. Thanks for the advice and I won't be using any more chemicals on him. I'll let you know how he does tomorrow. Hopefully he will continue to get better.

eddie · #9 (**permalink**) 12-01-2003, 05:51 PM

LdyDrgn · #10 (**permalink**) 12-01-2003, 07:37 PM

You are lucky he is ok... You should never mix chemicals like that, even if the base ingredient is the same.

Amy: PermaNONE is the replacement for Sawyer's.... Sawyer's now has DEET in it. Be warned!!!

Amiechan · #11 (**permalink**) 12-01-2003, 08:33 PM

We buy the Sawyers with Permethrin in it. They sell it with Deet (the stinky kind I bought and immediately threw away). Did they completely replace the Permethrin with Deet? It's been a while since I bought any.

LdyDrgn · #12 (**permalink**) 12-01-2003, 09:15 PM

Ted went to get some Sawyer's and they all had Deet. Then he looked at the PermaNONE and it had the permethrin without the Deet. *shrug* We haven't gone to see for ourselves, yet.

trinitywolf · #13 (**permalink**) 12-01-2003, 09:27 PM

This is correct...and it worked like a charm for me. My first mite infestation (I have no idea where they came from) has since been erradicated but PermaNONE. I had no side effects and sprayed it into empty cages then loaded the paper in them. I treated two times seven days apart and all mites were killed. I intended on treating again the third week but found no dead mites, so I decided to forego a third.
I believe that PermaNONE is just a Sawyers replacement...since they have "improved" it by putting Deet in it. PermaNONE was also found at Wally world.

Amiechan · #14 (**permalink**) 12-01-2003, 10:02 PM

no more sawyers for me then

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