first time owning a fishtank in a LONG time

Sleepy_FF · #1 (**permalink**) 12-21-2006, 05:47 AM

im used to goldfish and koi.. lol

anywyas. i have a 20 gal tall. it came with a filter (up to 30 gal) and air supply stuff.

i have 3 catfish and a "sucker fish" (cos i cant spell the name to save my life)

had some minnows in it too, but not many - the minnows got transferred to the watersnakes dish anyways.

so. i set it up, tis lookin good... add fish... feed them once, they ate all the food.

go to bed, wake up 6 hours alter, and the tank is CLOUDY... and "fishy"

whats wrong? this is the first time im a long time owning a tank, and im used to managing goldfish and koi in a 30 and a 50 gal.

tjhammerhead · #2 (**permalink**) 12-21-2006, 06:08 AM

It should clear in a day or two.

Oh and btw where are the pics?

Yungair23 · #3 (**permalink**) 12-21-2006, 06:11 AM

Bigger, More Powerful filter may helP?

Sleepy_FF · #4 (**permalink**) 12-21-2006, 06:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yungair23

Bigger, More Powerful filter may helP?

i am using a Marineland BIO-Wheel Power Filter for a 30 gallon tank. it filters 150 gallons an hour. it has 2 activated charcoal filters, and the bio wheel filter.

its a 20 gallon tank. the reason i had to remove the minnows is cos they kept getting stuck to both of the filter intakes

Quote:

Originally Posted by tjhammerhead

It should clear in a day or two.
Oh and btw where are the pics?

pics will come after:

a) it clears up!!!! (omg, i hope it does clear up)
and b) i get a top and a hood so i can give it full-spectrum lighting, as i plan on putting in live plants

tjhammerhead · #5 (**permalink**) 12-21-2006, 06:28 AM

Every time I set up a new tank, let it sit and stabilize, as soon as fish are added it clouds. It generally goes away in a day or two. What's the ph and nitrate/nitrite levels? How long was the tank set up and running before adding fish?

Sleepy_FF · #6 (**permalink**) 12-21-2006, 06:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tjhammerhead

Every time I set up a new tank, let it sit and stabilize, as soon as fish are added it clouds. It generally goes away in a day or two. What's the ph and nitrate/nitrite levels? How long was the tank set up and running before adding fish?

PH is neutral last time i checked (bout 2 hours ago), and i dont knot the nitrate/nitrite levels - i need to go get a tester kit for it tomorrow.

one other thing i REALLY regret is getting black gravel - im so changing that soon. i cant see my bumblebee catfish on it!

mpgt · #7 (**permalink**) 12-21-2006, 04:08 PM

Tracy, (sorry for the long post)

You should do an Internet search for “new tank syndrome” or “tank cycling”. I think your cloudy water is from ammonia, which is pretty toxic to fish. The ammonia comes from a bloom of anaerobic bacteria, which is a predictable, normal step in a new tank’s process of getting established. (This is why you never “clean” an established tank or filter too thoroughly.) Once the beneficial aerobic bacteria take over in sufficient numbers the anaerobic bacteria and the ammonia will disappear.

You should remove the fish if you possibly can. Catfish and algae eaters (if he’s a pleco) are hardy, but they have their limits too. The tank will cycle on its own if you get them out and leave that dirty water in there. I would remove the carbon until the tank is cycled. There’s good reason for that. You could speed up the process a lot by “seeding” the gravel bed with bacteria laden gravel from an established tank, or even putting an air driven corner filter full of it in the tank.

If you must keep the fish in there (not the best option):
You should do some water changes every couple of days (maybe 25% at a time). Bottled, deionized water might be best right now. I would even use tap water as long as it’s the right temp. Chlorine is not a terrible thing but you need to find out if your water company adds chloramines. If so, that’s another problem. If you can find some zeolite (some pet stores sell it for cat boxes. A few carry it for fish, but it's the same thing), add it to the filter or even put it in a mesh bag (well rinsed until the water runs clear) on the bottom of the tank. It absorbs ammonia.

The ammonia makes it hard for the fish to breathe, and they might eventually die from asphyxiation. You can help by adding an air stone or 2.

A 20-gallon tall will not be an easy tank to maintain. Any “tall” tank will have less surface area proportionately, compared to another tank of the same capacity. One of your goals is to get oxygen into the water and remove carbon dioxide (CO2). A filter, the bio wheel, an air stone in the water will all agitate the water surface. The water surface is where over 95% of that O2/CO2 transfer happens. If you add an air stone or bubble wand to the tank with an air pump, the bubbles rising to the surface “move” the water for you and agitate the water surface for you, thereby enabling the O2 transfer.

Also, the 20-gallon is small. The smaller the tank is, the less stable it will be, and the harder it is to maintain. If a fish dies and isn’t removed right away, or a little uneaten food decays, it can quickly upset the balance and put you back into the position you’re in today. It can work of course, but I think you should be on the lookout for a bigger tank.

You have a great filter, but you really could use a larger version.

How deep is your gravel bed? I’d keep it under ½” so it doesn’t accumulate too much anaerobic bacteria or dirt, and produce lots of nitrates. You could use rocks or little walls to create a few deep spots if necessary for plants.

Again, sorry for the long post. There's much more to say but I'll wait to see if you have any questions.

P.S. Once you get things right, you should change about 10% of the water (siphoning the gravel with a python) once a week.

mpgt · #8 (**permalink**) 12-21-2006, 04:30 PM

If you want to change the gravel, do it now before the tank gets established. Most of the beneficial, nitrifying bacteria in a balanced tank resides in the gravel. Changing all the gravel in an established tank might cause the tnk to cycle again like it's doing now. You want to create and maintain a stable, healthy environment for your fish.

It would be great if you could get enough gravel (with lots of bacteria) from a local fish shop (LFS) or someone else's well established tank.

Heidi · #9 (**permalink**) 12-21-2006, 04:38 PM

Great information Joe.

Another thing that you can do to help is to go to a "nice" fish shop and look around for healthy tanks. As them for a scoop of dirty gravel and put it in a stocking or just add it to the tank and keep it in there. The good bacteria from the used gravel will help with the cycling.

They also have some newer stuff out that I think really works. It has to be refrigerated so again make sure you trust the store somewhat so you know they didn't keep it out overnight. It is called Biosafe. It is nitrifying bacteria that helps establish your tank. It isn't cheap, I want to say I remember it being like $11 for a small little tube of it. Don't bother with the other "cycle" stuff. It doesn't work at all.

You may even be able to ask the store you got the fish from to hold on to the fish until the tank is cycled to minimize adding more and more fish poo. Feed very sparingly until the tank is cycled and add fish slowly to let the good bacteria equal out with the bad stuff being added to the tank with each fish added.

I love fish tanks but I'm waiting until I can get a really nice one and the kids (meaning the little hero) is old enough not to add extras to the tank.

amercnwmn · #10 (**permalink**) 12-21-2006, 05:36 PM

Great information, I was going to say something about cycling the tank.

Plecos are really neat, there are all sorts of different colors/sizes and patterns.

Slithers · #11 (**permalink**) 12-21-2006, 06:18 PM

Plecostemus.

Your tank is still cycling Tracy. It takes a week or so for all the levels to rise and fall to a normal range.

Sleepy_FF · #12 (**permalink**) 12-22-2006, 07:39 AM

i dont plan on doing a complete gravel change, just a "take some out, mix some in" till i get it the way i like it. the water is clearing up some (YAY!). id love to aim for a larger tank, id like a 50+ tank, that would ROCK.

i also can see the fish now since i got myself a light, lid and PLANTS. yay.

my plecostemus (thank you cut and paste!!) is an albino, it looks so freaking cool. the catfish are bottom swellers, i want a few mid-tank dwellers, that also look nice.

do i really need a bigger / stronger filter? this one's so strong, it sucks the minnows to the grille (which is why thay arent in there anymore, they either died from being on the grille, or they were eaten by the water snakes)

im so glad to have a tank again, i forgot how much i missed the sound of the filter. its like my own mini waterfall in there :P the fishy smell is also going away.

this is my first time in a long time having a tank, there are so many things ive forgotten about (like the water testing kits), and so much i can finally get into (live plants, maybe a snail?)

the majority of my experience has been saltwater tanks, actually. when we lived in guam we had a HUGE tank that was partially marine mixes and partly real seawater. we had all kinds of tropical aniamls, the neatest thing is that when my dad went shell hunting, hes put critters into the tank for a few days, then (if it was a shell) killed it and esxtracted the animal so he could add the shell to the collection (have you ever seen a C. textile eat? thats sweet), and if it wasnt, he would release it back into the same tidepool he found it in.

sometimes hes even eat the animal (after he boiled it to neutralize the toxins)

sadly, i am not in any sory of position to accomodate a saltwater tank. plus, i think i get to get back up to par with my freshwater one first

thanks so much for your help, you guys. i sounded like a total and COMEPLETE noob

Slithers · #13 (**permalink**) 12-22-2006, 08:55 AM

dood maybe the fish died and thats why it smelled funky. clean that water LOL

Sleepy_FF · #14 (**permalink**) 12-22-2006, 09:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slithers

dood maybe the fish died and thats why it smelled funky. clean that water LOL

with as much as ive been oogling my new critters, trust me, the minnows got taken out as ASAP

once the water is stabilized, i cant wait to take pictures.

NicoleRussell · #15 (**permalink**) 12-22-2006, 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slithers

dood maybe the fish died and thats why it smelled funky. clean that water LOL

lol

Heidi · #16 (**permalink**) 12-22-2006, 07:42 PM

Tracy, is it a biowheel filter. If it is a biowheel I'd say it is fine. If not then sometimes it takes a larger filter then called for. The biowheels are great.

Sleepy_FF · #17 (**permalink**) 12-22-2006, 09:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Heidi

Tracy, is it a biowheel filter. If it is a biowheel I'd say it is fine. If not then sometimes it takes a larger filter then called for. The biowheels are great.

yup! 30gal biowheel

LS84 · #18 (**permalink**) 12-25-2006, 05:49 AM

Yeah, itll definately get better...but plecos can get huge..a 20g isnt really big enough for how large they can get. Also you cant really as too many more fish, because the ones you have will grow and a 20 gallon cant hold too many. I think the rule is 1 gallon for every inch of fish. Just keep in mind growth and you can fit a fewmore smaller ones

Sleepy_FF · #19 (**permalink**) 12-25-2006, 07:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LS84

Yeah, itll definately get better...but plecos can get huge..a 20g isnt really big enough for how large they can get. Also you cant really as too many more fish, because the ones you have will grow and a 20 gallon cant hold too many. I think the rule is 1 gallon for every inch of fish. Just keep in mind growth and you can fit a fewmore smaller ones

oh yeah... i know plecos and catfish can grow relativly huge - im already planning on a bigger tank. just not NOW.

LS84 · #20 (**permalink**) 12-26-2006, 08:50 AM

its SO addicting!!! I started with a 10 gallon 2 years ago and realized that it just wasnt big enough...so i got the 55 gallon kit from walmart and made it a cichlid tank...upgraded the filter....upgraded the lights...than I realized i just had to have a saltwater tank...started a 29 gallon saltwater...than someone gave me a 45 gallon bowfront with all the supplies for free...so i just had to set that one up too to hold all the fish i wanted that couldnt go with the cichlids!..lol..now the 55 definately isnt big enough anymore! i cant wait to have my own house so i can have a HUGE tank...(in every room!)

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