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[Sliding Scales]

I have been doing a lot of research on freezing meat (in this case rats & Mice...still meat) and I have found some interesting things that I did not know. The best way for feeding F/T is to get the prey (rat or mouse...whatever) and kill them yourself, rather than letting someone else do it. Now this is if you want to have the best quality of frozen food, or the best way to preserve the food. You dispatch the Rat/Mouse, using the most humane method which I think everyone would agree is CO2. Then you should flash freeze the rats, which involves laying them on a metal pan and placing them in the freezer. (You can look this up on the internet) Once they have frozen quickly, then vacuum seal them (yes many of you do this) and put them in the freezer. Now here is what I found that I really did not know. They say to really preserve meat (rat/mouse...whatever) you need to have a freezer that will keep them frozen at ZERO degrees. I checked my freezer, and with the infrared gun it was 25 degrees. I checked it with my air thermometer and it was 15 degrees. I was surprised! I have been thinking of buying a chest freezer somewhere down the line, so I tried to find out what them temps would be for the basic freezer. Guess what? I could not find that info anywhere. The Frigidaires, Ammanas, all the good ones and they showed no info on how cold they would get. I found that only the commercial units would give that info. Arctic Air is one, and that dude will get down to 17 degrees below zero! Ya don't want to stick you tongue on that package! However...it comes at a price. Around $500 to $700 bucks for a small chest freezer. Just saying...and sorry if this is a bit off topic.

	Geek Auto Linker or Gallon Geek Auto Linker Gallon - United States liquid unit equal to 4 quarts or 3.785 liters

	Frozen/Thawed A rodent or other prey item that is frozen and then thawed to be fed to a reptile or other animal.

[HERPHAPPY]

If you are concerned about missing any vitamins you could always dust on a bit of Reptivite (or similar product...Nekton-Rep comes to mind). I seem to think you lose a bit with freezing too (enzymes etc?) and for that reason I switch off feeding f/t with feeding p/k...but I raise my own rodents, this is a bigger hassle if you have to buy live rodents etc. None of my current snakes are fussy eaters. You do have to be careful with some where switching will cause refusal of the less preferred format.

	Geek Auto Linker or Gallon Geek Auto Linker Gallon - United States liquid unit equal to 4 quarts or 3.785 liters

	Frozen/Thawed A rodent or other prey item that is frozen and then thawed to be fed to a reptile or other animal.

[HERPHAPPY]

Originally Posted by Sliding Scales

I have been doing a lot of research on freezing meat (in this case rats & Mice...still meat) and I have found some interesting things that I did not know. The best way for feeding F/T is to get the prey (rat or mouse...whatever) and kill them yourself, rather than letting someone else do it. Now this is if you want to have the best quality of frozen food, or the best way to preserve the food. You dispatch the Rat/Mouse, using the most humane method which I think everyone would agree is CO2. Then you should flash freeze the rats, which involves laying them on a metal pan and placing them in the freezer. (You can look this up on the internet) Once they have frozen quickly, then vacuum seal them (yes many of you do this) and put them in the freezer. Now here is what I found that I really did not know. They say to really preserve meat (rat/mouse...whatever) you need to have a freezer that will keep them frozen at ZERO degrees. I checked my freezer, and with the infrared gun it was 25 degrees. I checked it with my air thermometer and it was 15 degrees. I was surprised! I have been thinking of buying a chest freezer somewhere down the line, so I tried to find out what them temps would be for the basic freezer. Guess what? I could not find that info anywhere. The Frigidaires, Ammanas, all the good ones and they showed no info on how cold they would get. I found that only the commercial units would give that info. Arctic Air is one, and that dude will get down to 17 degrees below zero! Ya don't want to stick you tongue on that package! However...it comes at a price. Around $500 to $700 bucks for a small chest freezer. Just saying...and sorry if this is a bit off topic.

My Whirlpool (freezer on top style, which is proven to be the most efficient per Consumer Reports, and mercifully is the cheapest style!) gets to 0*....I have checked! and the temps. are adjustable but you have to check with a thermometer to see what the dial numbers actually achieve.

	Geek Auto Linker or Gallon Geek Auto Linker Gallon - United States liquid unit equal to 4 quarts or 3.785 liters

	Frozen/Thawed A rodent or other prey item that is frozen and then thawed to be fed to a reptile or other animal.

[Icicle]

I just gunned my rats in my freezer and they are at 15*

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[Mira-Icy]

Originally Posted by Rachel SS

Snakes stomachs are designed to eat "raw" prey. Think about it. You don't cook a rat before you feed it to a snake. The bacteria could be bad for you if you rubbed your hands all over a dead rat then stuck them in your mouth (ew)
If you leave rats in a freezer for years, yes you will lose nutritional content. But you should not be buying enough rats for a growing young snake for a year.

Lol very very true. But it does make you wonder how long those frozen mice have actually been in most of the freezers/fridges that you've seen. Same thing with food. I always have that inkling feeling about the frozen mice at the store.

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[DiamondCreek]

Originally Posted by Mira-Icy

Lol very very true. But it does make you wonder how long those frozen mice have actually been in most of the freezers/fridges that you've seen. Same thing with food. I always have that inkling feeling about the frozen mice at the store.

While it is probably not cost efficient with one snake, rodentpro.com doesn't euthanize/freeze the rodents you order until you order them. That is how the delay in shipping is explained.

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[Mira-Icy]

yeah but I have a small baby and I know she's not going to eat the full 100 mice in a month. so it would be a bit pointless for me for one snake lol. So really if all else fails until she out grows the little baby mice I would have to stick with live and p/k lol

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[DiamondCreek]

Originally Posted by Mira-Icy

yeah but I have a small baby and I know she's not going to eat the full 100 mice in a month. so it would be a bit pointless for me for one snake lol. So really if all else fails until she out grows the little baby mice I would have to stick with live and p/k lol

Yep. That is true. I've been raising my own mice and buying live medium rats and freezing them. But with my crew moving up to rats, I've made my first rodentpro order. With four snakes, it started making more sense.

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[Coffee Succubus]

I only have ONE boa at the moment and as soon as he's big enough to eat rat pups/weanlings(I think those come in 25packs? and will be soon), I'm ordering from rodentpro.

I'm currently doing mice from Petsmart for the time being. Sure, I worry about mice being a little less nutritional than rats... but he's still doing F/T.

I don't see the concern with frozen food though. Would you argue the same thing? "Oh hey, I have this steak/chicken that's been in the freezer for a month or two... I think it's lost nutrients, let me go chop up a fresh cow/chicken."

Most frozen meats for us are perfectly good for 6 months to a year depending on what it is and lack of freezer burn.

Doesn't freezing lock everything in place anyway? Nutrients and all? I could see the worry maybe after 2 years...

	Geek Auto Linker or Gallon Geek Auto Linker Gallon - United States liquid unit equal to 4 quarts or 3.785 liters

	Frozen/Thawed A rodent or other prey item that is frozen and then thawed to be fed to a reptile or other animal.

[Stargazer]

The type of freezer you use makes a difference. Frost-free freezers can dry out food more quickly than non frost-free freezers. Since all I have is a frost-free, I have the rats pre-killed at the store and bring them home and freeze them myself. I only buy 3 at a time for each snake, so nothing stays in the freezer more than 6-8 weeks. I also thaw them overnight in the fridge before warming. This method has worked well for me for 5 years, and both my boas appear very healthy.

It only takes one incident with a rat to permanently maim or kill your snake. Why even take the chance? It's also not for the feint hearted to watch a rat die being suffocated by a snake. I fed a live mouse once and had nightmares for weeks. I think it's cruel and inhumane to allow an animal to die like that. They are sentient beings, too (meaning they feel pain).

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[Rachel SS]

Originally Posted by Mira-Icy

Lol very very true. But it does make you wonder how long those frozen mice have actually been in most of the freezers/fridges that you've seen. Same thing with food. I always have that inkling feeling about the frozen mice at the store.

You can always buy live ones and freeze them yourself

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[Sliding Scales]

I use Buckrun Feeder Farm, Colorado Frozen Feeders here in Denver. Actually he is in Loveland CO, and he supplies me with what I need, frozen not live. I want to preserve them to retain the best nutrients, and like I said a freezer that will hit Zero is supposed to be the best. That is why restaurants use them, as that with vacuum sealing gives you the best quality for the duration it stays in the freezer. And no freezer burn. So for me a vacuum processor and a new chest freezer is in the works. It would pay for me though as I now have five snakes.

Oh...one other thing on freezers. Be sure to clean the coils on the back on a regular basis as it makes them work much more efficiently. My sister was ready to buy a new fridge once and being that she had four cats and two dogs, I decided to check the coils on the fridge. Plugged with hair! Yech!

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[Sliding Scales]

I just sent off an email to Frigidaire saying that I wanted a refrigerator freezer with a frozen Rat and Mouse dispenser in the freezer door.

What?? Its a good idea!

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[HERPHAPPY]

Originally Posted by Sliding Scales

I just sent off an email to Frigidaire saying that I wanted a refrigerator freezer with a frozen Rat and Mouse dispenser in the freezer door.
What?? Its a good idea!

That makes sense to me? You only need ice cubes in the summer, ya gotta feed the snakies year round!

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[DiamondCreek]

Originally Posted by Sliding Scales

I just sent off an email to Frigidaire saying that I wanted a refrigerator freezer with a frozen Rat and Mouse dispenser in the freezer door.
What?? Its a good idea!

It would be really sweet if it had a slider so you could choose the size to be dispensed.

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[HERPHAPPY]

Originally Posted by DiamondCreek

It would be really sweet if it had a slider so you could choose the size to be dispensed.

I wanna be there when you explain that to Frigidaire?

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[Sliding Scales]

I did already...you know what they said.

"OH RATS

	Geek Auto Linker or Gallon Geek Auto Linker Gallon - United States liquid unit equal to 4 quarts or 3.785 liters

[Sliding Scales]

Originally Posted by Mira-Icy

yeah but I have a small baby and I know she's not going to eat the full 100 mice in a month. so it would be a bit pointless for me for one snake lol. So really if all else fails until she out grows the little baby mice I would have to stick with live and p/k lol

The point is that with a good freezer that gets to zero, and vacuum sealing them, they should last forever with no degradation. It is air pockets that cause freezer burn, and the vacuum sealer will stop that, and also the proper temp (we all know about proper temps) of the freezer. Now as far as getting prey that is frozen and already has freezer burn, that is the rodent supplier. I know that Rodent Pro has a great reputation, and Buckrun Outdoors, where I get mine sells so much that nothing sets in the freezer long at all.

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[Byron]

I bought 100 mice even when I only had one snake. I did a little math and figured out that if I used 30+/- of the 100 mice, I was still coming out ahead.

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[Sliding Scales]

Originally Posted by Byron

I bought 100 mice even when I only had one snake. I did a little math and figured out that if I used 30+/- of the 100 mice, I was still coming out ahead.

LOL...yeah so did I. It was hilarious as I sat there and did the figuring this way and that way. I have already mentioned that a freezer that gets to zero and vacuum packaging would allow them to be stored indefinitely without nutritional loss. However...for those that don't want to wait a lifetime to see the savings for a new freezer (that is unless you use it for other things, as ANY meat is better stored like I have said) what you have pointed out is great! Nice post...thanks.

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