Thinking about feeding LIVE? Welcome to the Live Pile

[Adrya]

I mean the LEAST you can do is whack the rodent or feed freshly killed...

[Stigma]

Originally Posted by Stargazer

Aside from the risk to the snake, I cannot imagine what kind of person can nonchalantly watch an animal be slowly crushed and suffocated to death over and over without having any reaction. I fed mine a live mouse one time. The sound of the poor mouse squealing and the sight of it wetting itself was enough to shock me into tears. I will never do it again. I just don't understand the kind of personality who can be okay with that or think it's humane. You have to have a heart of stone.

star its the cycle of life...the big fish eats the little fish...it does not take a heart of stone to watch one animal feast on another...live or dead...i personaly LOVE watching animal planet when they have animal specials...watching a lion stalk its prey then ambush it with its pack (pride...whatever) is AMAZING if u ask me...


i will not comment on the whole FT "argument"...i feed my snake FT cause its convienient for me and i dont live near a breeder or petstore..i will also say i know it is a minor risk to my snake and ANY risk that can be avoided SHOULD be... but i have seen people literaly bashing other posters for their opinions on this topic...and all i can say is its not right...

[Stargazer]

It's a little different than the circle of life when you are raising animals in captivity, and you are choosing the method of death for the prey item--humane or inhumane. It is not natural for a live prey item to be introduced into an enclosure. Nature is certainly barbaric, in controlled circumstances, you have responsibility in the way the rodent dies.

I will add that I think if snakes had the option of dining on f/t rats in the wild, they would pick that option any day!

	Frozen/Thawed A rodent or other prey item that is frozen and then thawed to be fed to a reptile or other animal.

[WHO????]

Originally Posted by Stargazer

A) You only feed live when absolutely necessary, not cause you're too lazy to use f/t.
B) NOT a good thread to hijack.

I do apologize for my unintentional attempt to hijack... I do not wish to do such an impolite and improper thing, but was just taken aback if you thought I was cold and heartless.

okay...ummmm...."Go F/T!!!" There we go, had to bring it back around.

	Frozen/Thawed A rodent or other prey item that is frozen and then thawed to be fed to a reptile or other animal.

[Jane]

I'm not a fan of "bopping" as they called it at my old work, slamming a rodent on to the floor full force. I think I did it once...when the first "bopping" didn't do the trick, and it took off running. I did NOT like the idea of it running around like that. If I had to kill myself, I'd definitely go the CO2 route. This place has a couple of decent tutorials for inexpensive homemade chambers.

[Jane]

Um...kill A RODENT myself. My bad.

[Xeikeness]

I can do gross pics for you.







All those pics ----^ are after 4 months of "healing".




See that huge scar down the center of his head? His brain was exposed after that injury. From a rat. This is 3 years after the fact.


The rat bit him once. The one "small harmless" bite got infected. And fast.


After one rat bite. Rat's mouths are nasty, and harbor LOTS of bad bacteria.


Ah, here's a good example of what one rat can do.



Hope this helps. I can provide LOTS more pictures if you'd like.

[morti]

This weekend at Morehead, my darling wife ldydrgn was outside talking to some guy who said his ball python had been bitten by a rat and he was buying frozen food for it. We were quite pleased that he was buying frozen rats, and he asked for some advice on treating the wound. He said he lived right down the street and he would go get the snake and bring it in.

Now I have seen some pretty bad mouse and rat bites, but nothing prepared me for what I was about to see. I will just shut up and let the pics speak for themselves;




And just to add a little more insult, he had this little thing about the size of a nickel on his back:



Please please PLEASE don't feed live.

And now for the rest of the story...

So the vet "Wanted like a thousand dollars to just look at it". So he called his sisters boyfriends cousin or something like that who is a vet tech and she recommended putting honey on the wound as an antiseptic.

After seeing the extent of the damage (this poor snake's vertebra are exposed and have been gnawed on) I suggested that he put the snake down. He refused and is going to continue treating the massive wound with honey.

I had to walk away to avoid saying or doing something that would have put me in jail.

[majkill]

honey?? >.<

[Lucille]

I have never seen anything like that. Where the heck was the owner while his snake was getting butchered like that?
I think that goes beyong negligence, whoever let that happen shouldn't have pets.

BTW honey has been said to be to some extent an antibacterial agent but there are more effective preparations IMHO.

[majkill]

Originally Posted by Lucille

BTW honey has been said to be to some extent an antibacterial agent but there are more effective preparations IMHO.

Maybe so but that wound is way beyond 'holistic' treatment...

[Lucille]

I agree.

[morti]

The only reason the snake is alive is that it is on the right side. That is where the vestigial lung is. This wound is also about an inch above the heart. One inch lower and it would have gotten there.

I deeply suspect that the snake will never eat again and even if it does, the scar tissue that is going to form will prevent it from eating appropriately sized prey.

I really don't have much more info... I did not want the details. I was having to almost meditate in order to stay calm enough to avoid making a huge scene anyway.

[Jane]

That looks like excellent incentive to feed frozen/thawed or pre-killed. I don't feed live, but in all honesty, I had no idea that much damage (read: that big a hole) could come from one rodent.

[morti]

Originally Posted by Jane

That looks like excellent incentive to feed frozen/thawed or pre-killed. I don't feed live, but in all honesty, I had no idea that much damage (read: that big a hole) could come from one rodent.

I never knew a snake could live through an injury that traumatic either. That is absolutely the biggest and deepest wound I have ever seen on a snake that is still alive.

[Jane]

Agreed.

[LukaTisus]

Man.. that poor python. I gotta say I'm impressed you kept your cool, Morti. I probably would've lost mine completely with the attitude the guy seems to have.. I don't like to think I'm a tempermental person, but when it comes to stuff like that, I seem to be. D:

[louise]

omg morti yep, i would have went to jail.

[spix14]

That is just unbelievable. It never fails to amaze me how many people will refuse to take their snake to a vet just because they don't express pain the same way a mammal would. If that was a cat and it was lying around the house screaming in pain you can bet the guy would have done something more than put honey on the wound. Uhg. I need to shush before I end up breaking the profanity rules here. Kharma will catch up with that guy eventually, mark my words.

[louise]

i would love to be a nurse and that man end up in the hospital with bad wounds like that. i would throw some honey on it and send him on his way.